Breast Tissue Composition
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| 7. is the fatty tissue |
Hytten and Leitch 1971; Niefert et al. 1985 found that breast size relates more to fat than mammary tissue so larger breasts have more fatty tissue to deal with.
Clearly, for larger breasts you're going to have more fatty (adipose) tissue. It also depends on your age. Breasts of younger ladies (especially pre-pregnancy) are firmer and the percentage of fatty tissue is lower. As women age (and especially during menopause) the lobes (3. in the figure on the right) shrink and are replaced by fatty tissue, which means the percentage increases. Just to add to the fun your precentage also changes during your menstrual cycle.
The reason I point this out is because fat can be moulded. Don't believe me? Just ask any lady whose been doing tight lacing for awhile. It's also pretty obvious in an intuitive sense. That's what Spanx and other body shapers do. They squish and squeeze your fatty tissue into a more "desirable" part of the body.
When wearing the wrong bra size
In the vast majority of cases when a woman is wearing the wrong bra size she's using a cup that is too small and a band size that is too big. What she's essentially doing is forcing her tissue into a non-natural shape for her breast. Just like if you were to wear a corset or some sort of shaping undergarments the tissue has to go somewhere. In a corset often times it's pushed down into the hips, which creates a more extreme hourglass figure. In the case of an ill-fitting bra you're pushing the fat/breast tissue into your underarms and eventually into your back.I found this picture on a body building site (I don't want to repost it here, since I don't know this person but go see for yourself), which is a pretty obvious example of an extremely too small cup size on a bikini top. This then creates underarm fat. From the caption it looks like she feels that further weight loss/decrease body fat will help. To some extent, it may, depending on if she loses breast tissue or not. BUT some ladies are very unlikely to lose breast tissue during weight loss. Wearing the correct bra would fix this almost immediately as long as she bent forward and scooped in all of her breast tissue into the cups.
Wearing a too big back exacerbates the problem. For the following reasons
- A too big band allows for movement of the cups throughout the day and breast tissue is more likely to sneak in past the underwires towards your underarm/back
- A too big band can creep up your back throughout the day and ends up of hitting a spot that is less flattering.
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| Hot Milk Purple with Vintage Cream on Figleaves |
Ironically this picture is also from Figleaves and it looks like the cups are too small and the back is too big:
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| Freya Ada on Figleaves |
Even a smaller issue of not high enough underwires can cause this bra as I discussed here and you can see the difference here.
Are you sure that's actually breast tissue?
Yes. If you've complained about underwires hurting your sides that's because it's rubbing on breast tissue instead of just skin, fat, and ribs (unless you're in a very small band size where the pressure on you ribs could be the problem). Another proof for this is that ladies run into problems with clogged milk ducts when wearing the wrong bra size and/or not leaning forward and scooping in their breast tissue into the cups. The La Leche League cites Gubala, Judie and Karen Berg. Recurrent Plugged Ducts and Breast Infections. Conn-Tact, Fall, 1988. but I haven't been able to find this anywhere and have never heard of this journal so if someone knows where to find this reference PLEASE let me know!
I also want to point out that when scientists study breasts that don't look at women standing up but rather they are in the prone position using a proprietary breast coil. Using this manner ensures that the woman's entire breast tissue is measured correctly. So if you want ALL of your breast tissue in the cups of your bras you 1. need to have adequate room in the cups and 2. need to bend over and scoop it all into the cups.
Give it a few months
Let me put a bit of a warning out there about this. The leaning over and scooping method can only do so much when you initially try on bras. If you've been wearing the wrong size for years on end your back and underarm fat might be quite happy hanging out back initially. Over time (and persistently wearing the correct bra size combined with leaning over and scooping ALL of your breast tissue into the cups... even more than once per day), you'll find that you run into a new problem. Breast Tissue Remigration.
It's quite common for women to go up a cup size or two after wearing the correct bra size for awhile. The worse the undearm/back fat, the more she's going to go up in size in the long run. It's not always an immediate effect. I've recently gone up a bit. Currently, I seem to be in the 28JJ/K range at the moment, but I'm not 100% sure how much of that is water weight retention. My weight on the scale is normal so unless my cup size eventually goes down again it looks like I'm dealing with breast tissue remigration here, which makes a good chunk of my bras out of my size, unfortunately!
I wish I could give you a time frame for this but I honestly don't know how long breast tissue remigration takes. I've tried googling around for studies but breast health and research when it comes to bras is so woefully limited that there's not much out there on it. In my own case, it's a bit difference since my band size was changing so often due to weight loss that it might have made the breast tissue remigration take longer.
I'd love to hear from you, my dear readers. Have you experienced breast tissue remigration after wearing the correct bra size? How long did it take to remigrate?
Further Reading
http://www.thinandcurvy.com/2011/02/reader-question-bra-fitting.htmlhttp://sophiajenner.wordpress.com/tag/migrated-breast-tissue/
http://cupsandmeasures.wordpress.com/2011/08/28/from-a-30a-to-a-28d-without-surgery/
http://www.venusianglow.com/2011/12/proof-that-breast-tissue-can-migrate-to.html
http://www.venusianglow.com/2009/09/get-rid-of-armpit-rolls-in-5-seconds.html
http://eternalvoyageur.xanga.com/730061802/reader-question-tank-tops-and-breast-tissue-migration/
I had a decent amount of migrated tissue which I've managed to about two-thirds correct over nine months by readjusting twice a dayish. Just wearing the correct size helps a bunch!
ReplyDeleteDefinitely! Finding the right size+correct shape for your breasts can make a huge difference in the appearance almost immediately.
DeleteThought-provoking, June!! About two weeks ago, I had a customer send me the Venusian Glow article and ask if she needed to switch to seamed bras to get her side tissue to migrate. I had never heard of this theory before, so I sent the article to my sales reps as well as posted in a lingerie professionals group asking for feedback. The consensus from the sales reps and experts like Elizabeth Dale and Ali Cudby (as well as a professional corsetiere) was that there was no evidence to suggest you could use a bra to migrate breast tissue. Ali even mentioned that if it were possible to do this, retailers would use it as a marketing ploy to sell their products.
ReplyDeleteHaving said that, I also couldn't find any strong evidence to the contrary either. As you mentioned, it's not something that's been extensively studied yet; as a result, my only caution to women is not get your hopes up about it. Find the right size bra because that will help your confidence, your breasts, and your body in the long run (not to mention, a correct fit will feel more comfortable), but don't necessarily expect to go up several cup sizes or to migrate any tissue. I would love for more scientific studies on this topic to be performed because there does seem to be a debate on both sides of it, and I, for one, would like to know more about it! :)
Thanks for sharing that. I think there's a real issue with the lack of solid information (or basically any systematic studies done) on breast health/bra fitting.
DeleteI think it depends to on the extent of migrated breast tissue and a woman's past history. There are a number of pictures on google (just googling backfat) where you can see extensive back fat that I imagine would take awhile to get all of it into a bra. My guess would be that women who have see larger weight fluctuations and/or ladies would softer breast tissue would experience this more. Thus, in terms of a study that would need to single out specific groups of women (for instance, I'd guess that younger ladies who have not had any pregnancies, whose weight is relatively stable and who have firmer breasts would not really see this).
I wish I would've have been able to find that study from the La Leche League on underwires and clogged ducts. To me that seems like it would be a fairly strong indication that wearing the wrong size would lead to migrated breast tissue underneath your arms (but without reading it, it's hard to know for sure!).
Of course breast migration exists. One professional described it once as "the breasts do a little jump forward once properly fitted into a bra, usually the customer comes back after 3 months buying a new bra that is 1-2 cupsizes larger". The woman who said that was born and grew up above the lingerie store she owns, she is over 70 and has been standing behind the counter since she turned 16.
DeleteI also personally experienced the phenomenon. I used to wear a 44DD without wires bc that was the largest size I could find. I went to a specialist store and got fitted into a 95H Primadonna bra (UK size 42FF). Cost me an arm and a leg, but it fitted very well in the store. Imagine the nasty surprise I got when just two days later it got obvious that the bra was way too small, centergore not sitting flat and quadboob everywhere. My breasts had "done the jump" and I now wear a 40HH with Panache.
Thanks for sharing!
DeleteI am 80 yrs old but still like to be stylish. Am I too old to do anything about underarm and back flab? I was measured several years ago for the correct bra but have gained weight since and I look awful
DeleteI actually showed some pics in my latest blog post of the results of my breast re-migration! I had ordered a bra back in April, when I had just learned about bras, in 34HH, but returned it because I didn't like the look, despite a close to perfect fit (in fact, perhaps it was a bit too big?) recently I ordered it again, but now my breasts are much bigger! (and I've also lost weight, so I think it must be re-migration!) I didn't take a picture of my armpit 'fat' back then, but I wish I had, because I also feel like I have less. See it at the bottom of this blog-post: http://xlhourglass.blogspot.dk/2012/08/sleeping-bra-alisha-by-panache.html I hadn't thought that a bra could do so much, so fast, but it really shows that the 38F's I was wearing before were just no good ;) So even though it has been really slowly gradually, and I am not there yet, but I just placed a 7bra order, so hopefully soon!
ReplyDeleteThanks so much for sharing! I'm bookmarking this for when I get home for work to read it more thoroughly. :)
DeleteI'm pretty sure I've had some remigration with breast tissue but it's hard to tell for sure since I've gained weight and stopped nursing since I was properly fitted (so I'm wearing the same size as I was nursing right now, but I'm heavier.) I do get some little bulges under my arms, but I think it;s genuine fat given the location up at the crease of the arm pit alongside the strap. I don't see how I'd possibly move that down. If the wires were up too much higher it would bug me (although now I want to compare the look in my Deco, which I have on today, with my CK Fleurty, which is much higher under the arms for me.
ReplyDeleteTissue migration is also why, IMO, I am still able to wear a 34 band despite having gained 40 pounds! The fat got squished out of the way by my properly fitted bras (I was a small 34, possibly a large 32 when I got into the right size; now I'm a large 34.)
It would be interesting to hear how a comparison between your Deco and CK FLeurty went. I know I get significantly less underarm fat when I wear a Curvy Kate bra because of the high underwires (and also the generally firmer backs.. at least in the sheer cup bras).
DeleteThe Fleurty definitely looks better because of the nice wide band. The problem with the Fleurty is that it left lines from under my arms and up the front until about my collarbone because of the width of the wings and general height of it so it cut in (although it did soften up with wear). I had to size up in the Fleurty to an H from my usual GG (and it's still right at the edge of being too small) and the change in the cup shape made it awfully high for me. But I have high breasts even though my torso is average so the change in cup size can be problematic for me at times.
DeleteFor me, the little bulges are visible even without my bra, up above even the scoop of my shirt near the crease in my armpit. I really still need to lose 50-60 pounds though.
I have been wearing too small bras for 20 years so I will start a blogging project about migration. Since I'm practicing HAES and demand feeding since 2007 I have a very different perspective on the issue. Also as I have a somewhat more "antropological" interest in the issue I just see it very differently.
ReplyDeleteI will try to do a blog mythbusting experiment project and I'll try to have fun while at it.
My biggest problem now is that I don't have any fitting bra just yet. And I finally am very clear about why :)
I have a long torso just like you, but then also my boobs starts out just behind my arms. So I need huge wires.
Also I have a crease under my boobs that's more square than round which means no bras are quite made for my boobs. So I will have cups wrinkling and wires looking too big. Cannot help that, I don't wear too small shoes and try to adjust them by loosing the lace so I certainly won't wear too small wires and try to adjust it with deeper cups.
My size fluctuates a lot with the cycle of the month so I cannot really tell what's migration and what's PMS and what's even my boob muscles being bigger right now.
CK Emily 30J-JJ (both) fitted me a week ago. On Saturday I needed the 30K. Days later I almost cannot fasten the band and my boobs looks smashed in the 30K. So I might even need a 34JJ or 32K right now. But I don't know. Because I don't have those sizes at home to try. And when the 32J and 32HH I bought will arrive here - Murphys law applied - they will probably bee too big :D
Panache Andorra 32J - rests on tissue, Freya Pollyanna and Antoinette 32J rests on tissue.
Wires wide enough for my pms boobs really make me look like an idiot because those cups will look too big even if they aren't. Again shoes and lace.
Maybe my boobs yield more to the shape of the cups while not on PMS. Doesn't help now.
So I've been braless most of the time for a week now. I put on a bra if I need to go out (I'm retired), but as my PMS boobs also are quite firm I just go around flexing my boob muscles to keep them up.
I probably look better without a bra than with a wireless.
I've been at odds as to why on earth I could be full on top when I drown in every cup in my size, and I've never quadraboobed before this summer, but now I do think it's because I've always had wider and more shallow boobs. Typical 1800 century corset cleavage boobs.
I wish there were open top plunge bras with really high and wide wires. Seemed not moulded. I only wear pushups in cleavage :)
One thing I'd suggest is tracking your cycle and making sure to try on certain sizes either during PMS (or when you're not having PMS). I definitely need about 2 cup sizes up during PMS and sometimes even a back size up, so I can definitely relate to how you're feeling. Also know, that if your cup size increases significantly during PMS than your back size will feel too tight (even if it is the right size).
DeleteIt could very well be that you do need different shapes during PMS and during the rest of your cycle. That's why I'd suggest just working on fitting each of your shapes/sizes separately.
Ha, the legendary armpit breast tissue migration. Oh, how I hoped for thee.
ReplyDeleteI am not saying it's a myth I have seen quite often myself in others.
Alas, it has not happened for me. I still have a considerable amount of wibbly-wobbly under my pits. Or especially in the back, if the band should sit flush. Higher underwires and braod bands help, but higher underwires often poke.
I think the higher underwires thing might be a personal preference (and come down to torso length). I can definitely get away with higher underwires but I also have a long torso so they never poke me. I can imagine, though, if you have a short distance between your underbust and armpits that you get stuck between a rock and a hard place. Either you wear short underwires for comfort but get some underarm fat or you wear taller ones and end up getting poked. :(
DeleteNot sure if there's a real solution there but if you find one let me know!
At least for your back fat... if you continue to bend and scoop during the day does it improve?
Corset tightlacing isn't actually about just shifting fat around, an experienced tightlacer is moving internal organs around as well (and when done right it doesn't even hurt).
ReplyDeleteWhen I first discovered 28 bands I was 28DD/E. A few months later I was E/F. I assumed this was due to actual growth as I was in my early/mid 20s at the time and it can happen then, but I always thought that was a bit odd as the rest of puberty happened very early for me (I reached my final height at 13 for example). Breast tissue remigration might explain it better.
That's certainly true. But I know at least with shape-wear and corseting (maybe not done permanently) that it does move your fat around- at least temporarily. I tried to find some research on it but couldn't... I still wonder to what extent tighlacing is moving around organs and what extent it's also redistributing fat? Surely there is some sort of combination of the two but I couldn't find any good research on it.
DeleteIt does sound like that might very well be a case of breast tissue migration. Certainly, boob growth is still possible in your 20's but it seems a strange coincidence so quickly after wearing the correct size. :)
I'm currently wearing a cup size bigger than the first well-fitted bras. I haven't gained weight, so I'm quite sure it is due to my well-fitted bras. Either breast tissue remigration or a change in my shape because of the better support.
ReplyDeleteThanks for sharing! That's an interesting point too about a possible change in shape due to the better support. What sort of changes in your shape have you found?
DeleteI'm just wondering if you sent the young woman a message about armpit fat?
ReplyDeleteAfter your comment I checked and didn't see an email address available. It looks like you might have to sign up to post there?
DeleteI think that better support and scooping can make breasts bigger and fix armpit fat issue to certain extent, but photos at http://www.venusianglow.com/2011/12/proof-that-breast-tissue-can-migrate-to.html actually prove nothing, because obese men have the same folds of flesh on their backs.
ReplyDeleteMalica
Yes, but male breast tissue is similar to female and often when they gain weight they also gain in their chests, so it would be very similar. There are also males who have more developed breasts: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gynecomastia
DeleteYeah, males' mammary glands aren't developed, and otherwise structure is very similar, but they don't wear bras, so their bodies distribute fat naturally. That's why I think that folds on one's back isn't necessary evil done by wrong fitting bra, it's just how it is for us, humans, if we do nothing about it.
DeleteMalica
I've been wearing Ewa Michalak bras in a 32FF (best fit I've ever had) which fitted perfectly for the first few months, but recently I've found (despite no weight gain) overspill from the cups when I adjust myself during the day to move tissue that's shifted near the wires and is causing me some discomfort.
ReplyDeleteI don't doubt that it's tissue that has migrated into the right place and right now I struggle with the overspill and tissue moving back towards the underwire during the day because I need to go up a cup size to a G.
So I'm a big believer in tissue moving back to where it needs to be, particularly when accompanied by a firm, well fitting, supportive bra. I'm going to try a G cup bra soon and see what difference it makes to the need to adjust during a day and the overspill I've started to see.
Thanks for sharing!
DeleteA month ago I went to Bravissimo for a fitting and discovered that I've been wearing bras that are two cup sizes too small for almost two years (shame on me!). The lovely bravissimo lady fitted me properly and it was a wonderful transformation (no more back pain and my clothes fit better). But a month later and I can tell that I need to go up another cup size - the underwires are resting on tissue at the front and at the side. I might even need to go up two more cup sizes.
ReplyDeleteAfter just a month!
I didn't really have a lot of backfat before - but I did have little bulges around my bra straps and especially at the front of my armpit. Now I look a lot smoother and less 'bumpy', even compared to a couple of weeks ago.
I had never heard of breast tissue re-migration until I read this post so this is a revelation for me. I don't know how else to explain what I've noticed over the last few weeks.
I really wish someone would do some proper research about it.
Thank you very much! Keep up the great blog!
Clare
Hi again!
DeleteI got very interested after reading your post and tried to find that article you mentioned by Gubala and Berg. No luck, but here is what I found out (you may already know this?).
ConnTact is (or was) a newsletter for the La Leche League in Conneticut.
Judie Gubala lives in Rocky Hill, Connecticut (http://lllalumnae.org/sites/default/files/continuum/continuumjan2011.pdf) . You might be able to contact her somehow and find out more? I can’t find anything about Karen Berg. I sounds like the authors are lactation experts and their findings are gained from experience rather than scientific research (nothing wrong with that of course – but I do think there needs to be some research done!)
Clare
Oh, thanks so much! I'll see if I can find a way to contact her somehow.
DeleteYes, I'd love some actual research on this. Certainly life experience is important too but it would be nice to have some stats on it. :)
För everyone reluctant to believe breast tissue can move http://www.breastcanceranswers.com/breast-tissue-occuring-in-armpit-what-should-be-done/#.UF084Lst1Is
ReplyDeleteGreat news about this is that revolutionary treatment like Zeltiq nyc is available to get rid of back fat.
ReplyDeletethere is finally someone else who says it is DEFINITELY migrated breast tissue! i agree and know that this is a fact- females are NOT meant to have rolls on their tummy. it is not natural.
ReplyDeletei've been observing and noticed that no german females on tv or anywhere, or even just random fans of tokio hotel that i saw, german celebs jena pallaske & lafee all seem to be wearing the right-sized bras. and there are the rare american celebs like christina aguilera and alyson michalka who all have flat tummies but big breasts. most people think that they've probably had plastic surgery, and wonder why no matter how much christina gained weight, her tummy stayed flat?
it's because most of them were wearing the WRONG bra size and didn't find this believable that someone much bigger than them could have such a flat tummy. that's because everybody is supposed to be like that. even if you don't have rolls, and ur tummy looks pretty flat, you may still get a line on ur tummy when u bend over, or have some loose-feeling skin behind your armpits- that is still migrated breast tissue.
rihanna is like this- i have observed and could tell that she has a flat tummy, but still has migrated breast tissue. people who have only briefly researched this and think that if the "fat" aka tissue behind the armpits don't come back up within a few months, that it is just plainly back fat. i used to think this.
but now i know for sure, that no female is supposed to have loose rolls of fat behind her breasts or underneath it. even if they aren't rolls, if you feel that the loose skin behind your armpits or on your tummy is kind of separate from the actual skin behind the "fat" aka tissue, then it is definitely breast tissue. '
do not even listen to bra fitters or even some doctors who say that it's a myth and that isn't possible, because i actually went to a bra fitter who claimed she was a "professional" and said that it is simply impossible for breast tissue to be migrated. she also said it was impossible for me to be any bigger than an A cup... well, im actually approximately supposed to be a G cup when i move all this tissue back up so uh.. she definitely got it wrong there. so don't hesitate- if you're wearing a B cup and have lots of breast tissue, you might just be something like an F cup or anything. don't feel overwhelmed by the cup size like i did, because this just makes you waste more time and money! buy the bigger cup !!
im only 16 but it seems that i know a lot more about this than most of the women on earth!
when i grow a bit older, im gonna have to make this problem widely-known so that all skeptic woman will actually stop and listen.
the "ah bra" and blah blah will be needed no longer because i will try to or someone else will have to come up with a better idea that fix this problem. remigration .... something needs to be created to make this process faster!
Intriguing article! I'd never heard of breast tissue migration. I've just gone up a bra size (Australian 16C to 16D) and am wearing underwire moulded bras for the first time. I am getting uncomfortable rubbing on my right side (the larger side) although it seems to be partly friction from my arm moving with mouse work or knitting. But I'm definitely trying the scooping more than once a day. Not sure if I'll be pleased or not if the breasts get bigger still - I've spent a lot of cash on those new bras and still haven't got over grieving for my comfortable old ones! :D
ReplyDelete